3 Phrases To Stop The Sales Negotiation

3 Phrases To Stop The Sales Negotiation  – Transcript

Rob  00:08

Welcome back, everybody to The Slow Pitch and today we have a special guest who has a question. Erick, you want to give us a quick synopsis of what your question is?

Erick  00:19

Hi, Rob, thanks for having me. On your show, I’ve been a listener, I’ve actually listened to every single episode took me a while to think of a good question. And I didn’t want to think something that somebody already asked me. Over the last couple of weeks. Basically, I’ve done some visits to potential new clients, and also to some existing clients. And I’ve run into a particular individual style. And it’s basically when when they’re very frugal, right, that it doesn’t really matter what you say what you’re going to fix how you’re going to do it, what you’re going to do for them the value that they’re going to bring, it’s going to bring to them, it’s all about how much is right, it comes to the conclusion that I think if I even say it’s free, it’s too expensive. Right? Wow. So I know that’s what they need in right. So that’s my question, how do you deal when that happens? Or should I just walk out and lose the opportunity, right? Because any could be two different scenarios. One, he’s the decision maker, or she’s a decision maker and two, he or she’s part of the decision making?

Rob  01:22

Yep. Okay. All right. So that I think that’s a good question. You bet somebody that’s really frugal, or you call it cheap, which whichever way it doesn’t really matter. It’s somebody that is not kind of playing nice here with the numbers. And they’re kind of negotiating. So I look at it as are you you’re trying to flip that negotiating table a little bit, right?

Erick  01:39

That’s correct.

Rob  01:40

Well, let’s dig into that. How to Flip the Negotiation.

V/O  01:41

This is The Slow Pitch Podcast.

Rob  01:45

Alright, so we’re trying to figure out how to flip the negotiating table a little bit on somebody. And so Eric, you know, first of all, thanks for joining me. And I really appreciate you listening and going through all the episodes. And I really appreciate you reaching out and saying, Hey, I have a question. And I’m glad to have you on. And so the the question is a good one. And I have several questions back to you. So let’s run through this real quick. And I think, hopefully, this will be helpful for other listeners, because it’s not if it’s happening to you, it’s gonna be happening to probably 1000s of other people out there. So my first question, I think, would be when you have the conversation, I’m assuming this is any any stage of the conversation, it’s either early in the conversation or earlier on first half, they haven’t signed the agreement. They haven’t signed any contracts. They’re trying to figure out whether or not they’re a good fit with you. You’re a good fit for them. Right?

Erick  02:32

Yes, but it’s also happened on existing clients, right? When you try to do like a business review. And a lot of the times, obviously, my industry, our costs go up. So you know, it’s a domino effect, right. So it can happen on existing or new deals. But yeah, typically, this this one in particular was a new prospect.

Rob  02:50

Make sense? Okay. And so everybody knows, are you comfortable sharing what your industry is?

Erick  02:54

Yes, absolutely. So I have a company called simpliitfy stands for Simple IT for you. We do it in cybersecurity for small and medium businesses where the were managed services provider, typically, we help small businesses with their technology and cybersecurity.

Rob  03:10

Okay, it makes sense. And so I think what I’m hearing that is, is that whoever you’re calling, this individual is saying, I don’t need your services at that price at particular, I don’t need them. I don’t need your service.

Erick  03:20

Yes. Or they’ll say, this particular technology. It’s not needed. It’s too expensive or too small. Yep. That kind of thing. We’re too small.

Rob  03:28

Okay. My first question to you would be if, if you were to go back in time and think about having this conversation with that person? What were your questions that you asked that helped you understand what it’s costing them to not do that your service? Or were there any questions that you asked that you found out? It’s, if they don’t take your service on, it’s going to cost them any money? Or it’s going to cause a problem in the future?

Erick  03:52

Which basically, I told them what the problem can’t be, right? It actually happened to them. But okay, just wouldn’t listen. So now obviously, it’s a completely scenario now that that has happened. Now they’re listening, but we could have prevent a lot of the issues if we were to just listen and not only just put the money or the or the financial value to it, that makes sense.

Rob  04:12

Yeah, it does. So if they would have listened to you before the issue wouldn’t have happened. But more importantly, they you had that conversation with them before, they didn’t think it was worth the service. Now they’ve had that happen to them. What did that cost them to have that happen to them? Like, what was her you know? Was it a was it a big expense? Was it like, hey, just a few bucks, and it was like, who cares?

Erick  04:33

It’s probably going to end up costing them anywhere between $2,500 to $5,000 in damages, okay, that’s if we’re able to recover that that was lost, but okay, that’s not counting the value of you know, redoing internal time they lost some files due to data recovery, they’re gonna have to no good backups,

 

Rob  04:53

You know, just based on that, if it’s going to cost them on the low end $2,500 Or on the higher end, possibly $5,000. And so, you know, I’m kind of I’m kind of new here. I don’t know, is that a little? Or is that a lot? Like, is that significant for them? Or is that just like, hey, that’s, you know, chump change, I find that in my culture reading for

Erick  05:10

the for the size of the organization and what it is compared to that a backup would have cost them with this particular scenario, you know, talking about $25 or $50 a month, which is nothing really. Now, you have to pay for a back of that picture to pay that for years. But yes, the hustle and the headaches and employees more all that, you know, hey, I lost all my files kind of thing. It’s also affecting them, right? Yep. Clients reputation. So there’s so many not only the financial factor, but there’s also the intangibles. Right, yep.

Rob  05:37

So one of the things I heard you say earlier was before this happened to them, you told them, This is what you’re going to run into as a problem. And when you do run into this problem, it’s going to cause you these issues. Yes. So now do you call them back and say, I told you so? Or how do you deal with that?

Erick  05:50

In this particular scenario, they have other people in the organization. So you got escalated. But I think that’s probably one of the things that was my mistake. All the decision makers, everybody should have been in the room, it was more like there were this there was an individual handling. And that individual handling was frugal and made made everything challenging. But again, how do you how do you tell them? Hey, we need everybody in here?

Rob  06:14

Yeah, so that’s interesting. I think that’s your right, that’s probably the first mistake, if you will, or looking back, you wish you could have done differently, I’m sure that’s listen that I do that I’ve done that before. And it’s not a big deal. And everybody has that problem any given time, we can all think of a situation where that’s happened. So don’t worry about that part. But if you were trying to figure out how to get other people in the room, for those of you listening, if you’re ever in that situation, and like I need I know, there’s another person here, that should be in the room with me, there’s a couple of questions that you can ask. And that is like, hey, when you’ve had situations like this, or you’ve dealt with projects like this before, who else is involved in the decisions? Or who else has input? Or another good example, sometimes what I’ll ask for is, you know, when I’m in on a call like that, and they say to me, you know, no, I’m the only one, I’m the only one and I know better. Like, I know, there’s another person behind the scenes that should be involved, I might, I might say something, one of two things, I might say, you know, normally I would see this level vice president or the marketing officer, or the whatever I might mention a role that I know is in that organization, and say they’re typically involved at some point in this conversation. It may not be today, but maybe the next conversation, is that do you see that possibly happening? And sometimes they’ll open up and say, Yeah, I think I just need to weed some things out now. And if we make it past me, then then I’ll bring them in. And that’s okay. Because you can get some initial preliminary conversations going. And then for me, I won’t even get into the numbers until that person’s in the room so they can ask all they want, but they have to be in the room in order for those numbers to come in. You know, one time in the past, I’ve had it where somebody said to me, you know, I would like to have a monkey involved in this project. And I, and I literally stopped everything and said, I, I’m so confused. What do you mean, you want a monkey involved in this project? And they said, Well, it’s a, it’s like a icon, like a, like a, like a, like a logo like a like a person that’s, you know, it’s like, it stands for something in our organization. And I’m like, that doesn’t make any sense for what the topics that we were talking about what we were dealing with, it made no sense whatsoever to have the monkey in. And so I had to say to them, that makes no, no sense. But I couldn’t say that, right. So I had to say, well, help me understand what you’re trying to do with that, why you’re trying to add that in. And that’s when I started bringing in these other people, right? That conversation because of that monkey conversation, what I’ll say when they say there’s nobody else involved, I bring up that story. And I say, you know, we had this contract agreed upon, everything was going smoothly. And then the new person that came into the room later said, I want to monkey in this project. And I was like that was not in our contract, right. So that’s why it’s really important to get them in as early as possible. Because if I had that in there, now, now I’m changing price. I don’t want to do that to you. That kind of tells them or explains to them and kind of a funny way, because it’s a real story that actually happened, that gets the other person in the room. And so that that’s a couple of ways to do that. But now you know that that person should be there, you know that there’s a way to get them in the room. Fast forward, let’s say we could have gotten them into the room. How much into the pain conversation? Did you What were you able to get into that with the problems that could be happening? Did you get into that a lot with them? Or I did how far into that?

Erick  09:28

And at some point it becomes, I guess I can Eagle effect on the individual because they wanted to do it or they mentioned that they were doing it in another fashion right or in another way that okay, yes, he gets the job done. Now file backup, but at that point, it clears my hands because now it’s their responsibility. Right. So they said we don’t need what you’re suggesting, because I’m getting it done this way. And getting it done this way has worked for us for many years. And then at that point, it’s basically okay, you’re gonna handle that piece but when something actually happened. Yes, way.

Rob  10:02

So when wasn’t working? Yeah. So in that, in that conversation where you you when they’re saying, Well, we’re doing this, we’re doing that we feel like we’re in good shape. Did you ask? And again, I’m gonna be presumptuous here that you’ve probably did. But did you ask the question? So why? Why am I? Why are we even meeting then? If you’ve already taken care of what do we need to do, then you’ve already got it covered.

Erick  10:21

I mentioned those things. But obviously, you have it so broad, but we had other responsibilities. So but it was always it was not because they didn’t need it. They didn’t need the solution. They just didn’t want all the focus was the money. And that’s, that’s

Rob  10:36

Yeah, whenever and maybe another question, and then we’ll get to the money piece. Another question I would ask is, you know, if you’ve, you’ve heard the show, and I know, you know, some of this stuff, because we’ve talked about it before is the desk, do you know, the DISC profile or this individual?

Erick  10:49

I would say it’s a D, high D and compliant. Alright. If I have to guess he’s okay. A high D and C, compliance.

Rob  10:59

So they had both?

Erick  11:00

Yes.

Rob  11:01

All right. And before we started recording, we had a conversation and I know who this person is? And what if I told you, I don’t think they have as much of the D personality as you think? Yeah,

Erick  11:10

I would say that you’re more of an expert when it comes through.

Rob  11:15

But I just I just know, but I just know that because of my interactions with that person. So my question then becomes, if you know that there, I see, let’s say now, is there something that you would do differently? Or what would you have said? Or what? What do you need to do with a high C?

Erick  11:32

And I’ve tried to set for things like, hey, when was the last time that a restore was done? Can you show me the results? Can you test it in to me? Let’s just get it out of the way kind of thing? I guess. Yes. So we’ve tested, we’ve done it. Let’s move to the next next one. We don’t need it right. But he goes back again, the circle goes back to I just don’t want to spend this money.

Rob  11:52

Typically, when somebody doesn’t want to spend money after you had a meeting like that. And if you’ve gotten into a little bit of a pain, and you’re dealing with somebody who’s highly analytical, the question then becomes, does the pain match what they’re saying? And does the value of what you’re providing offset that at all?

Erick  12:10

And I would say, it’s more of I think the personal values or the personal thoughts exceed the company’s values or company’s goals for this particular scenario? I don’t know if that would makes sense.

Rob  12:22

You mean, your what you would need to charge?

Erick  12:24

No, no, no. I mean, I feel like the situation on this particular deal was the individual, his personal beliefs come in more than the company’s beliefs? Right.

Rob  12:35

Okay. That’s a good point. So when you deal with pain, you can talk about what it’s affecting the business. But you always have to get to that next level, which is how does it affect them? And so in that conversation, there’s might be a time where you have to say, alright, if this was to happen, how, what would happen next? What would you guys need to do? Like, let’s say everything got wiped out? Data Wise, you had nothing? How quickly? Could you get back on line? How does that affect you personally? Now, if you if they can’t answer that question, it’s because they haven’t thought about it. And I would honestly, I would sit almost in silence, waiting for them, because they’re a see they’re comfortable silence, waiting for them to tell you how it’s gonna affect them. Because they may say, and they may 1, you know, well, I don’t know that it would, but that’s their job. Right? So it’s gonna affect them somehow. And if they said, well, it’s not gonna affect my job, and it’s not gonna affect me, then the question would be, so there’s no, there’s no ramifications. If you lost all the data, and you couldn’t recover any data. There’s no ramifications for you. Is that what you’re saying? I’m just make sure I’m understanding that I would be willing to bet he would say no, that’s not true.

Erick  13:42

So then my question becomes how do you deal with somebody that’s high? See, but it’s also I don’t want to know, I guess I don’t know if that’s the word but a little bit cocky, you know? Yeah. Like, I don’t even know that’s,

Rob  13:56

That’s a front though. So remember, that’s always a front. It’s like, same thing, when you call the call? If you don’t, you know, you’ve done that before. I’m sure they always tell you. No, I don’t need that. And the reality is, is, you know, they might need it. And they would engage in a conversation if they actually trusted you. So maybe they just feel like there’s not enough. They don’t feel like they can trust you unnecessarily. And it’s not so much like they don’t trust you with their data, it’s that they don’t feel comfortable with you yet. And so maybe it’s a matter of with a high C, maybe. And again, I don’t know how that conversation started. But if you if you give them a handshake and kind of patting them on the arm, that might turn a C personality off where they’re going to be like, This person just gives me a weird vibe. And we’re I don’t like them, just because you touch their arm, right? There’s certain things that you can say to a high C will turn them off and turn them away as well, which can lead them to be a little bit more cocky and maybe a little more of a wall up. I’m not sure what happened with that part of the conversation. And knowing this individual I understand that that could happen only because I know they are very protective of their decision making. So think about it in terms of a see, they’ve made a decision in mentally maybe you made a decision already. And now you’re questioning his decisions. And that’s not a good position for you. So that’s where you have to ask them a lot of questions to make them understand that you’re trying to learn and help them. And they then can start to make their own decisions the way that they want to make them. Does that make sense? Yes, just knowing that individual, sometimes that’s what it takes. And then the other, you know, I think you’re dead on with having the other person or people in the room who are decision makers, because this person’s a high C personality, they’re also very, like you said, compliant, that’s the C standpoint, right? The C stands for, because they’re so compliant, when the boss says, or the boss is the different people that are running different areas of the organization, say, this is what we’re going to do, because we don’t want to take on that risk, that person is going to go with it when they’re high. See, they’re just gonna say, yes, they are okay, they’re gonna make it happen, they’ll figure it out. They may not agree with it, they just okay, this is what we’re doing. So sometimes that I think that when you run into a situation where that person’s ice trying to make decisions on their own, but they have people overhead, they’re trying to protect themselves as well in their decision making. And then if you’re questioning their decision making, that’s bad, but if you can bring in somebody above them without making them feel uncomfortable, they then will start to collaborate or accept things that are coming their way, when it’s coming from above. Does that make sense? It does, to me, pain is the biggest issue. And if you couldn’t get to the point, and if it comes across as, Hey, your your this is too still too expensive, then one of two things. One is they’re just not ready. And that’s okay, too, is they don’t have the budget for it. Because they don’t see the pain as high enough. They don’t recognize that the issue is as big as it is. And now that it’s happened to them. Now it’s going to cost a little bit more, I’m sure. Because there’s work the extra work you have to do. And the preventative work that you would have done before. Right. Right. So yeah, so now Now you’re gonna have another conversation, how are you going to deal with that? Where you’re like, Well, I know I said this, but now it’s actually more,

Erick  17:09

Which now have less than another lesson learned is basically because let’s pretend it actually happened, right? Like, there was there was an issue and have communicated back and forth. And then all of a sudden, the hires see me or contacted me and thinking, What are you doing? How come this hasn’t been done? I’m like, well, so I also have to learn how to protect myself when something arises to make sure that all the decision makers or all the executives are aware of what I recommend and how we want it to resolve because again, once we presented the solution of this needs to go into disaster recovery, data recovery, that is solution was never presented.

Rob  17:48

So, yeah, no, totally. And that’s another reason why they had to be in the room, right, that individual other person that need to be in the room. And by when they asked you that question, I mean, then then the obvious question back would be, you know, I’m not I’m not sure why it didn’t get done. We were ready to rock and roll. I don’t know, maybe, maybe you can give me some insights and make them make them prove it like you. Maybe they maybe they say do you back to Will they he told me you were gonna get this done already. Maybe they maybe he he tried to cover his own tracks, maybe there’s all kinds of things that could happen. Right, right. That’s the hard part. And so when it’s just an individual that standing in your way, that’s okay. If they come across, hey, you’re being too frugal, that’s typically a sign of not getting enough pain and getting enough direction from that person. They’re not an advocate, it sounds like so they’re not your advocate on the inside, if you will, that’s also problematic. So that’s when you start to bring in those other people and other individuals, even if it’s an eat, sometimes it’s just as good to bring in an equal of theirs, to get that extra feedback. But I’m of the mindset that I will go as high as I possibly can to get in front of the right person and get kicked down. I would really get kicked out. And there was a time not too long ago, where I was essentially this I saw a posting online for a project, I called the highest person possible, like they run the whole organization. And they said, I’m not really the one that will make the decision on that. I rec I suggested that they do that though. I thought so. And he goes, but you know, who is working on that as this? And I basically said, Well, I don’t know who that is. And he said, Well, let me just give you guys an introduction. And you guys can start to have that conversation. And then I just asked him, I go, Well, what happens if we’re in that conversation? And they don’t know if we should move forward? Or not? What I mean, can they make that decision? Or do they need to come to you? And he was like, no, they they have to do it themselves? I can’t I’m not going to be involved in that decision. They they have to decide who they’re using. I know they need to do it. And I know we want to do it. It’s a matter of who they’re you’re going to use and I said okay, well that’s different. And so we got into some other conversations too, but he kicked me down in a very friendly way. And that’s how we got into the next stage of the conversation with an individual he kicked me to and guess what? They think that I’m the best friend with that guy. They think I know him personally. They think that I know all kinds of information about him and that we go out and grab drinks. We don’t. I know him. I do know him personally, I met him one time. But that was it and what a difference it is when you’re coming from the top than the other way, right. And I think that would have been the better situation, if you could have done that from that doesn’t always work, I get that. Sometimes you just can’t. And they kick you to somebody and you end up and just to hold. But the more that you can understand the pain portion, and then understanding their disk and some of the dynamics that are happening behind the scenes that can make a huge impact on whether or not you move forward, or you get to work with somebody else and bring somebody else as a, I call it like a partner that they bring them in. And they and they work through that problem. So does that. Does that help? Does that answer the question enough?

Erick  20:39

Yes, absolutely.

Rob  20:41

All right, good. I’m glad that helped. I hopefully, if anybody else has another question out there that they would like to have answered, send that in or reach out to us. Maybe we have you on the show as well. Until next time, don’t forget, slow down and close more because you actually will close more when you slow the process down. Thanks for joining us, everybody. Thank you, Eric, for joining me. I appreciate it.

Erick  21:00

Thank you.

V/O  21:01

Thank you for listening to The Slow Pitch. Do you have a question about sales? Call or text your question at (608) 708-SLOW. That’s (608) 708-7569. Or you can email them to Questions@TheSlowPitch.com Slow Down and Close More.

Rob  21:51

Thanks as always, for listening today. If you’d like this podcast, please subscribe and leave us a review. We really appreciate it. Follow us on Twitter, Instagram and Facebook at The Slow Pitch. We were mixed today as always by Johnny Polakis. And we were produced by High Gravity Studios. Music credits and other notes are in the show notes section on TheSlowPitch.com And we’ll be back with another episode soon.